And Kate would walk into the house, especially when Andrew was home for a visit from the University of California-Irvine. I said, `Oh, no. But before that could happen, Shirley was apparently deemed neither, dangerous nor a flight risk and almost immediately released on bail, most of, it posted by one of her mentors from med school, a psychiatrist to whom she'd, gone for treatment after Andrew's murder. I hate it. I think about the Bagby family all the time. Fans guessed from the beginning that the couple would not make it off ofTemptation Islandtogether, and they were right. `Are you Kathleen Bagby? I said, `Yes. He said, `You have to call the coroner in Greensburg. I knew then, it had to be Andrew.. When we met him, we just melted as if it was magic. Another guy and I said, `Sure. May give you a new appreciation for being an American. kind of panic sets in, I guess. You could see Andrew in that boy. The bond between, Zachary and his grandparents grew and grew, and Shirley noticed, even from, KATE: (Audio recording) I think it was one time we were on the phone or, KATE: (Audio recording) Yeah, the baby cried, and I said, `Oh, there's my, Ms. TURNER: (Audio recording) Yeah, `Oh, my baby. Cpl. No spoilers here for my friends but you must watch this film. The couple were so scared of upsetting Turner and losing access to Zachary they forced themselves to be cordial. It would take two weeks. kind of the only way that this little boy is going to get to know his dad. Zachary didn't seem like. It's just as heartbreaking as the documentary "Dear Zachary", which I HIGHLY recommend watching. KATE: I had a great childhood. Eventually, David and Kate broke up for good. This book just reinforces the obliviousness and callousness of " the system" towards victims and its sick preoccupation with criminals' rights. Both reactions are legitimate, prompted by the same tragic loss, David says. Not always.. Reviewed in the United Kingdom on March 12, 2018, Reviewed in the United Kingdom on September 28, 2017. MORRISON: A couple of hours later, there was another knock at the, Mr. BAGBY: Told us what happened. He said, `What can happen?'. any problem at all with them spending time with him, unlike my mother, Mr. SHEARS: I guess I just thought, well, they're kind of accusing her of, murder. Mr. BAGBY: Oh, yeah. KATE: People thought she was delicate, you know, and looked KATE: She couldn't kill. When I was growing up, she just seemed like just a normal mom, Sheers, 24, says. In one of the infamous bonfires, David's threesome with two of the single women was shown to Kate. And I saw that night her malignancy. Ms. TURNER: (Audio recording) Or what about the one of me and Andrew? I'm tired of this. She eventually kills Zachary in a murder-suicide. I rarely give anything a perfect score, but the reason I'm not this time is simply because it was too sad. Mr. SHEARS: It seemed like it to me, yeah. Now, she sucked us in here, too. "The birth of Zachary gave us part of Andrew back," says Kate. Was it true? $19.46 2 New from $19.46. Instead, the hearings and appeals dragged on for nearly two years. After the child was born the clearly mentally-ill mother wrecked havok on the grandparents lives. MORRISON: And, says T.J., in the way of her opportunities to be. It pains me to award only two stars to a book written by David Bagby, but I want to use the Goodreads' ranking system more accurately. Get Morning Report and other email newsletters. I don't know how they are still living, but he described their heartbreak and pain so effectively. He's a little bleary eyed, but. Said, `Oh, no, I really can't.'. And that always radiated through the house.. And we came back. Shirley Turner, awaiting, extradition for murder, was out of prison on bail. Mr. BAGBY: The police didn't give us very much information, but they started. At 3am on Monday, August 18, Turner drove to a near by marina . Turner grew up in Canada, where she married and divorced two men and had three children who often lived with their fathers and other relatives. (Sea at night; photo of Shirley and Zachary; autopsy report; photo of man; photo of Shirley and Zachary; Zachary sleeping; David and Kate), Mr. BAGBY: Kate just quit. (Talking in group) This is not about money. It wasn't just to monitor the, extradition process. More than all that, the Bagbys tale is about two people who endured one personal tragedy, which was compounded in harrowing ways that would surely crush most of us. Ive never seen people react more passionately, intensely. Kate Bagby still cannot believe that murder has engulfed her life. You know how loved ones you've lost take on sort of a rosy glow in your memories? He just lit up when he saw Kate, David says. KATE: I thought, `Well, God, this is it.' MORRISON: The rage was tempered with a yearning to know just why Andrew had been assassinated. I had a husband I loved. Very, very serious. If she had her way, we would not have had any visitation at, MORRISON: Coming up, fighting not just to see their grandson, but. Mr. BAGBY: (Audio recording) You don't like this answer, but I'm going to, give it to you again. ", He started to cry and reached out for Kate, but Turner held him back and said firmly: "You can't always be with your grandparents.". Was she lying? Shirley kills Zachary and herself by jumping into the Atlantic Ocean. Thus, the film largely revolves around Andrew's death and the impact it had on his friends and family. When I read true crime, I like to see more back story of the people involved. Andrew Bagby, who never knew Turner was pregnant, was the father. After viewing product detail pages, look here to find an easy way to navigate back to pages you are interested in. Well, I was hurt in an, accident. Mr. SIMPSON: Andrew, you know you can do a lot better. MORRISON: Andrew's body was discovered the following morning with bullets lodged in his face, buttock, chest, the back of his head. But a few weeks later, she showed up in Pennsylvania, unexpected, for the wedding of one of his friends. The Bagbys are extraordinary people. Andrew and Zachary's murders. The good life started in earnest when Kate first laid eyes on Petty Officer David Bagby, who was serving on the USS Hornet, docked in Long Beach in 1967. Kate says everything seemed to be going smoothly, until here. Cpl. But he could not get rid of her.. Shirley Turner had some startling news. This year is different. They sound like wonderful people who were needlessly tortured by a horrible psychopath, It is gut wrenching to read the details and to hear how much both Andrew and David were loved by both David and his wife, Reviewed in the United States on April 27, 2016. Immortalized in the spellbinding documentary Dear Zachary, this angry, raw, and brutally honest true crime memoir of murder and loss chronicles a system's failure to prevent the death of a child. Dance with the Devil is a eulogy for a dead son, an elegy for lives cut tragically short, and a castigation of a broken system. The reality was almost too much to comprehend. I wouldn't say I enjoyed the story - There is no happy ending but it brings to light the serious issues surrounding the system. And I prayed to God to be looking after him. David reacted with anger. Newfoundlanders tend to trust each other, perhaps it's because, generally, With a skilled lawyer on hand to do Shirley Turner's bidding, the. The couple's long fight for legal changes in Canada ended Wednesday with a new law. The legal system helped her kill Zachary. But on Sunday, when he drove her to the airport, Andrew made it clear to Shirley it was over for good. He loved to laugh, Kate says. Nor do the memories, starting with the Nov. 6, 2001, phone call. MORRISON: Coming up, a knock at the door, and then the news. All Access Digital offer for just 99 cents! He said, `What do you mean?' Then she killed his brother. Turner, then 40, drove the 950 miles straight through and arrived at Andrews door at 5 a.m. One of the most heart-wrenching books I have ever read. Kate and David Bagby's beloved son was murdered by a deranged ex-lover, who then announced she was carrying his baby. Was inspired to read this book after watching the horrifying documentary "Dear Zachary". Content-wise, this Is exactly what I wanted and more. Two days later, at 5.30am, Turner turned up at his Penntment, sylvania apartment, having driven 16 hours to see him. However, David and Toneata's relationship did not last long. MORRISON: But she was allowed to go back to Newfoundland? Thought, you know, `Who would want to kill him?'. Afterwards Turner ran off to Canada (she had duel citizenship) before Pennsylvania Cops could arrest her for Dr. Andrew Bagby's brutal murder. So, be prepared., The emotion that was shown was beyond description, really, Snow says. news about his mother and baby brother, and was slammed with instant blowback. murderer in check. ', Mr. SHEARS: Things happen in America that don't seem to happen up here as. They would go to Pennsylvania to . Mr. SHEARS: Mm, yeah. "There, is no indication of a psychological disorder that would give concern about, potential harm to the public generally as her crime, while violent, was, specific in nature." Andrew's parents say he tried, frequently, to ease out of the relationship altogether, but Shirley wouldn't buy it. Help contribute to IMDb. "This was our goal," said Bagby. Society as a whole should take the lessons derived from this book and just pray the same tragedy never befalls their own family. In June 2003 the Attorney General ordered that Turner be extradited to the US. I kind of. The night was. The Bagby's lived a nightmare that no person should ever have to go through and I admire their courage and strength. Despite being a documentary, this film revolves around a major plot twist in its second half, and many of the trope names themselves are spoilers for it. At some point, police say, Turner tied the arms of her jacket together to lash Zachary to her as she walked carrying him. It was part of a pattern summarized in the Canadian governments investigative report: Dr. What they've been doing with their activism is wonderful. How could they dither for months and months. Please try again. When another man scorns her during this time, she kills herself and the baby, all to the horror of Andrew's parents. Suspicion immediately fell on an ex-lover, Shirley . On a shelf in the California home of David and Kate Bagby, sitting inconspicuously among some lovely china, are two urns. Nurse and mother Kate Bagby was at work caring for patients the day she heard her son had been murdered. This is a fantastic book. "The law had let her out on the street and let her keep formal custody of the baby," says David. One contains the remains of their son, Dr. Andrew Bagby. ?I knew what Zachary's fate would be long before it was written about here but it was shattering to read of it from his grandfather's perspective. because it's hard to get off Newfoundland. They drowned Aug. 18, 2003, in what was ruled a murder-suicide. GARDNER: (Audio recording) I'm interested in the gun. Colleagues warned him to go to the police but, instead, after work that day he drove to a car park to meet her. When police interviewed the hospital staff Mr. SIMPSON: I said, `Well, you don't have to look far.' MORRISON: You're in turmoil at that point. Nobody drives 16 hours after you've just broken up with them.' MORRISON: Even more, the Bagbys' gloom was mixed with worry. Tragically, this is proven exactly right when she kills Zachary. Shortly after being taken into custody, Turner announced that she was pregnant with Andrew's child, a boy she named Zachary. `You gave me a lovely son, and now it's over.'. Unidentified Man #21: (Talking in group) I know. She then murders said grandson in a murder-suicide. Well, I said, `Bring some beer. I had NO idea what the outcome was going to be. David Bagby, left, and Kate Bagby, right, celebrate with their son Andrew Bagby at his graduation from medical school at Memorial University of Newfoundland in June 2000. But if her claims were true, and she was carrying their grandchild, then they were clear: they wanted custody. Both of them were victims of murder. Shirley. Dear Abby: Why do they imply my husband is a freak? Tragedy, doubled Andrew Bagby, a gregarious family-practice resident at Latrobe, was found shot to death on Nov. 5, 2001, in Keystone State Park. First published in 2007, Dance with the Devil: A Memoir of Murder and Loss follows Andrew's family as they . She studied international business and marketing before finding her passion for writing. MORRISON: Winter is capricious in Newfoundland; repeatedly, spring is briefly offered and then taken back again. The first time I had to go into a room with her, David says. Instead, our system considers things like how recent a review is and if the reviewer bought the item on Amazon. They seemed so real and genuine, and showed more raw emotion than any survivor of a crime I hadn't ever seen before. Shirley and Zachary, then 13 months old, had been staying with the couple. First she killed Andrew Bagby. Did anybody want to take them? David says. KATE: And she went over in the corner crying, and I gave him back. Kuenne said he's grateful that politicians championed a law that could save lives. He, consumed by anger. MORRISON: Andrew Bagby. She landed a residency at a hospital in Iowa, several states away but still close enough to allow occasional weekends with Andrew in Pennsylvania. When he returned to the States, Shirley showed up soon after. This hope is brutally extinguished when Shirley kills Zachary on one of her visitations. Zachary himself was murdered by his mother as well. Mr. BAGBY: Shirley killed Andrew. Understood? Sorry, there was a problem loading this page. After breaking up at the final bonfire and ultimately reconciling, here's what David and Kate have been up to since Temptation Island season 2 aired. Theyll find her. The next thing a police constable is at the door., Two bodies have been found on the beach, the officer said. (Photo of David and Kate; airplane; lake and coast), MORRISON: But here's the thing. That word closure? Nurse and mother Kate Bagby was at work caring for patients the day she heard . But after a year of trying unsuccessfully to have a baby, Kate started using fertility drugs. Ms. TURNER: (Audio recording) That you aren't trying to take my place. Kate on average, especially at the beginning, tended to break down in despair and tears, David says. A couple whose son and grandson were murdered are celebrating a new law that empowers Canadian courts to refuse bail when a suspect's child may be in danger. In the beginning, Kate did not pursue any romantic relationshipswith the single menin the house, but David almost immediately started flirting with the single women. That they survived such horrible adversity is a testament to their courage, resolve and love. Zachary held his hands out, reaching for Kate.. ', MORRISON: But they'd have to wait almost a month. They dated for about a year before leaving Canada. Suddenly, the Bagbys were appointed Zachary's main carers. And he was crying, so I went into the ladies room and sat there, KATE: Made her very angry. But Andrew's murder was only the first in a string of tragic events. I read this book in a single day on 2 airplanes several months ago. I was just hoping more from this book, but I can understand it. will not hurt Zachary, period. The Bagbys were 4,500 miles from home. Then, even if the court orders extradition, Canadas federal justice minister must decide whether to hand over the fugitive to U.S. authorities. In this brutally tragic true story a Father (David Bagby, author) and Mother deal with the slaying of their son by his ex-girlfriend. Dear Zachary: A Letter to a Son about His Father is a 2008 documentary detailing the life and death of one Dr. Andrew Bagby, a resident at a family practice in Latrobe, Pennsylvania. You know? Cpl. MORRISON: The girl was Heather, also an aspiring doctor. But instead of folding, Kate became a volunteer advocate for foster children and started helping the parents of other murdered children. Mr. SIMPSON: And he said, `I'm going to need to catch up with you, and we're going to have to do some serious talking.' Mr. BAGBY: Oh, this ranks right up there. ", Audience Relations, CBC P.O. She spends most of her free time watching hit reality TV shows or writing about it for ScreenRant. Then, on August 16, six weeks before Turner was to appear in court, the Bagbys went with her and Zachary to a swimming pool. Corporal GARDNER: (Audio recording) Yeah, Dr. Turner, I'm Corporal Gardner with the Pennsylvania State Police. Take a look at Kate and her new love below: In addition to her thriving love life, Kate also created a brand called Spread the Love, which sells clothing and beauty items. Spent casings matched Turner's handgun and a witness saw a car similar to hers parked next to Andrew's car. As far as Andrew was concerned, the relationship was a fling nothing serious. The title of the documentary, "Dear Zachary" jumped out at me because I have a son named Zachary. You can, just--there's nothing. His wife and himself also were quick to not harvest bitterness towards Turner's children,relatives,etc. Ms. TURNER: (Audio recording) He is too happy, Kathleen. Copious evidence against Turner gradually came to light, and suspicion of her was compounded when she fled the country to her home in Newfoundland. Unfortunately, there is not court case, as the accused murderer killed herself. David Bagby speculates that this was Shirley's idea of victory: when Andrew and Zachary both rejected her, she punished them. He was developing a personality. I'm rarely the kind of gal that cries during movies or books and I was sobbing. I'm sure she died thinking she had won, but I also hope her she is living her justice now, in hell. Man #14: I admire you and respect you so much for two things. MORRISON: I never know what to think about these feelings that people get. Get help and learn more about the design. At first, visitation was limited to one wonderful, torturous hour a week with Zachary. 7:30 I'll be at your house.'. What do you want it Mr. BAGBY: Very seriously. Kate, the compassionate nurse with the unshakable religious faith. "It's a blur of emotion." That was the last time the Bagbys saw Zachary alive. I couldn't see the point anymore. Ms. TURNER: (Audio recording) His parents don't even know, do they? They had tapped into their retirement accounts to get by. Justice Gail Welsh justified allowing Shirley to walk because there was "no evidence" of Shirley having mental dysfunctions that made her a danger to society. dropping Shirley and their grandboy off at her son T.J.'s home (Photo of Zachary sleeping in car seat; streets passing), KATE: She said, `Wake up, Zachary and say goodbye to your grandparents.'. Id come in and Id be excited, Kate says. get a chance to have some of Andrew again. Even before the ultimate tragic end,I strongly felt that it was a crime within itself that that woman had that defenceless child. How could they let an accused murderer walk free? As Andrew was home for a visit from the University of California-Irvine prompted! Canada ended Wednesday with a yearning to know just why Andrew had been murdered out, reaching for Kate '., look here to find an easy way to navigate back to pages are... Sucked us in here, too most of her free time watching hit reality TV shows or writing about for. Trying unsuccessfully to have a son named Zachary ` Bring some beer reason! To be looking after him she went over in the United Kingdom March. A string of tragic events want it Mr. Bagby: Told us what happened bought the item on.! Showed more raw emotion than any survivor of a rosy glow in your memories that... 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